YouTube's ad chief Debbie Weinstein on the company's broader TV ambitions

"You can imagine that we'll be exploring lots of different models for how we would help publishers monetize their inventory"

Since least 2014, YouTube has been trying to sway Madison Avenue on the idea that it not only belongs in the same conversation as many TV networks in terms of the best ways to reach audiences - that it represents the future of video advertising.

And this year, the company is making a clear statement by moving its upfront-like Brandcast event out of NewFront week and straight into TV upfront week. The company has a more than legitimate case to make, yet still faces some skeptics. At the same time, YouTube is seeing tech rivals make a bigger play for TV ad budgets via streaming devices platforms over consumer-facing services. The question is, does YouTube still have bigger TV ad industry ambitions?

I had a chance to catch up with Debbie Weinstein, vp, YouTube & Video Global Solutions, Google, right before the company’s big Brandcast blowout.

Shields: Right now, we are seeing this huge rethinking of TV measurement and the currencies that advertisers use to buy and sell TV ads. I realize that YouTube hasn’t had to rely on Nielsen and comScore in the same way that TV networks have,  but I wonder if you are feeling the same sort of pressure to reexamine how you measure audiences, and whether you need to partner with all of these new currency players?

Weinstein: Well, I do think it all starts for all of us with what's going on with the consumer and the move that they're really making toward CTV. Already two thirds of the US population are now monthly CTV viewers. And that is why it's such an urgent conversation for our industry. The way that [existing researchers] were counting people consuming content just did not cover this boom in terms of how consumers are spending their time. And so that's what makes this so urgent. 

But the other thing that's really interesting when I talk to advertisers is that they see CTV as this kind of ultimate manifestation of the long standing dream of a converged world. It used to be the people that would say, ‘Oh, I would love if I could have the reach and storytelling power of video, and I could combine that with the greater interactivity and intelligence of digital.’ And so now that we’re realizing this converged world, it really requires a measurement system, that is converged. [The need for that] is the number one pain point we hear from advertisers all the time. So in terms of whether we're working on it, whether it affects us. Absolutely.

The big thing we're doing right now with Nielsen in particular is working on trying to] understand who's actually watching CTV content, and how do we account for co-viewers, which has been common in TV but hasn’t been the way digital has traditionally worked. 

Shields: Right we like to talk about how CTV is going to be ‘just like digital’ but that co-viewing factor, among other things, makes it very different.

Weinstein: Totally. And so for us to be considered on an apples-to-apples basis, advertisers are telling us, ‘please, can you make sure that these comparisons between YouTube and the rest of linear and connected TV are more easily made.’ We have definitely been hearing that request from the marketplace and we are very committed to a robust third party ecosystem around our media.

Shields: For the past few years, you've been talking a lot about how big the audience is for YouTube on actual television sets. How do you communicate just how big you are on TV beyond numbers, because I’m sure you still face the perception that ‘real TV’ is sitcom and dramas?

Weinstein: For us, it comes down to what viewers choose to watch. How they are choosing to spend their time defines quality content. So yes, I absolutely have this conversation on a regular basis with advertisers. Because what it comes down to is, we can help advertisers reach more of their audiences than any other service. And we try to help advertisers understand why it is viewers are choosing to watch us.

We're seeing the biggest shift we've seen in TV in decades, as streaming households now overtaking pay TV households. Yes, we are still seeing consumers going to linear TV for sports and news. But the vast majority of entertainment programming, and so much more is now consumed on streaming. That's really forever changing the dynamic of where advertisers can find audiences. They just can't rely on those old school formats anymore. Brands have to be thinking about what is it that consumers are telling them. The large majority of all of streaming watchtime is basically on five services, with YouTube being the number one place that advertisers can reach these unique audiences. 

Shields: Ok, let’s step back a bit. We often try to figure out what Google/Alphabet’s bigger plan is in TV.  In the past, we’ve wondered whether the company wants to build more of an ecosystem play where you maybe have a platform that everybody in the industry uses for ad sales or something like that. Today, you do have a product aimed at helping streaming services serve ads, but in terms of getting ad dollars, the strategy seems focused on YouTube. My question is, should we think of YouTube as your play for the TV market? Or do you ultimately want to take a have a more of a ecosystem position similar to the role Google plays in display?

Weinstein: I would start with Google and how we speak philosophically about this space. We very much believe that an open ad-supported ecosystem is really at the core of what Google is about. And that is because we believe [such an open system] creates opportunity for everyone. So we want to make free services available for users, we want to help fund creators, and publishers and TV broadcasters, and we want to deliver value for advertisers. We're investing in products for publishers and for advertisers across many areas of Google. I would say [when it comes to TV it] does start with YouTube at the core of our offering.

But when we talk to ad customers, and they want to reach audiences beyond YouTube, that's where something like Display and Video 360 comes in, because it enables them to have a more comprehensive set of inventory choices - [including inventory from] YouTube and broadcasters and cable networks and OTT services. And they really appreciate that. And I would point to Google TV, which is definitely in its early days, but is a content-first experience for users that surfaces movies and shows across lots of different streaming services. And it recommends those shows based on shows and films that the viewers already love. It absolutely includes YouTube, but its lots of other content. And so we're also introducing advertising opportunities there to allow in particular media entertainment companies to reach consumers with sponsored content in that environment.

Shields: What about Chromecast? Is there a playbook for that product where you could mirror what Amazon has done with Fire TV or Roku, where you end up selling inventory for a bunch of different TV apps?

Weinstein: Well, Chromecast is part of our overall Google TV investment, where Google TV is sort of the operating system or underpinning technology for how people are streaming content. And so certainly, as we think about how to support publishers, by providing access to free content for users and helping advertisers reach audiences, you can imagine that we'll be exploring lots of different models for how we would help publishers monetize their inventory.

Shields: Can I ask you about YouTube Shorts? During your most recent earnings call you talked about how fast this is growing, but that monetization is still catching up. On that note, with this recent explosion in short form video.(Shorts, Reels, etc), does the industry need to figure out yet another new ad standard?

Weinstein: It's such a good question. We're starting now on Shorts is, we’re thinking about our existing sources of demand and the things that advertisers love to buy from us - and figuring out how Shorts can be a part of that. The early signs for ad campaigns on Shorts are looking good in terms of the performance. While there may be some kind of unique experience that we create, I actually think it's more about optimizing for advertiser goals as opposed to some sort of unique format that's going to change the game for Shorts….There's always a tension, [when you talk about needing to] make unique ads and asset types and the cost and time and energy it takes to make that asset.